Removing rear ABS on 2012 rocket roadster.

[scot in exile]

Never ever under estimate the stopping power of the rear brake or you will find out the hard and painfull way what your rear brake could have done.
The front brake has far more power than the rear, so why use the rear at all? That's pretty simple: In an emergency, are you going to be satisfied with 70%, or even 95%, of your braking power? Not a chance. If both tires are on the pavement then they both have some traction. In an emergency, use it all.

How about that routine stop at the traffic light? I don't need 100% of my braking power there; maybe more like 5%. Do I need to use both brakes there?

It is called muscle memory of being prepared for the emergency. If you routinely use just one brake when the wanker stops in front of you, what are you going to do? You're going to do what you always do, in short a lot of old riders use the rear brake, new riders like to use just the front brake where they learned that from who knows, riders taught correctly will always use both brakes even if the rear is only 5-15% of the stopping power it is still 5-15% of the stopping power.

This question will soon have no meaning as the powers to be are pushing for all motorcycles above 125cc to have abs brakes as standard.
This is a simple overview of course you have weight movement, type of pads etc etc etc to take into consideration.

 

[albertaduke]

How does locking the rear save anything? you will have less grip, (reduced coeficent of friction than when the wheel is rolling) less directional stability, and a lovely flat spot on your tyre!

I have raced on and off road, and riden most big crusers. But can't think of a reason to lock the rear other than making lots of smoke.

Not many can out brake a modern ABS system, some of the old systems were a bit slow at reacting but the modern stuff are quicker than we are. So unless you just like to wreck tyres leave it connected.

Pierre

Amen to that !!!! nice to know I am not the only one advocating the use of front brake over the rear.

 

[warp9.9]

If your rear brake is locking up and the bike is turning sideways I would have to say something is wrong, and its not the bike !!!!!!

 

[joey fletcher]

Pierre

Do a search of my post a Bad Day Riding to see how locking the rear helped me.

I guess I learned it the hard way..when riding Motorcross back in the Old days..
I ran in the open class....350 to 500 CC ...2 strokes. Only had drum brakes and compression release on these monsters and I mean monsters..
I was 6'2 and 160 lbs...yes too tall...Ok.....But my 500CC in top gear would pull a wheelie with me laying on the handle bars once it was on the pipe.
When you dive into a 180 turn at speed...pull the compression release with left 2 fingers...Throttle still at half power and just as the front tire touched the burm.....stab rear brake..locking the rear tire...kicking out the rear tire about a foot or so...release the rear brake and the compression release.....drive through the 180 at half power then full power as soon as the bike was pointed in the correct direction...

I learned that I could make drastic moves on a bike using this and weight transfer. I do not think it is something that you have time to think about in a panic stop...But it does come to me naturally...I have used it quite a few time in the last 40 yrs. all to the good I might add.

Oh....One other thing....Have you ever had to lay a road bike down...I have
Try it with ABS

 

[Evil Mitch]

Never ever under estimate the stopping power of the rear brake or you will find out the hard and painfull way what your rear brake could have done.
The front brake has far more power than the rear, so why use the rear at all? That's pretty simple: In an emergency, are you going to be satisfied with 70%, or even 95%, of your braking power? Not a chance. If both tires are on the pavement then they both have some traction. In an emergency, use it all.

How about that routine stop at the traffic light? I don't need 100% of my braking power there; maybe more like 5%. Do I need to use both brakes there?

It is called muscle memory of being prepared for the emergency. If you routinely use just one brake when the wanker stops in front of you, what are you going to do? You're going to do what you always do, in short a lot of old riders use the rear brake, new riders like to use just the front brake where they learned that from who knows, riders taught correctly will always use both brakes even if the rear is only 5-15% of the stopping power it is still 5-15% of the stopping power.

This question will soon have no meaning as the powers to be are pushing for all motorcycles above 125cc to have abs brakes as standard.
This is a simple overview of course you have weight movement, type of pads etc etc etc to take into consideration.

Absolutely if people are locking the rear wheel they obviously are not familiar enough with their machine . I use both when stopping at lights and yes u are correct about muscle memory becoase when I stop in an emergency I use both and I don't lock the rear. When I first purchased the bike I locked the rear a couple of times but once I was familiar with the bike no problem. I also ride it everyday which helps . I think a lot of the time it's weekend warriors that lock the rear because they are out of touch with their machine or guys who have been riding for ever that started out on a vintage bike then had a break from riding and recently got back into it on a far heavier more powerful machine but think they are the best riders on the planet because they had their first bike 35 years ago . Far more experienced riders here than I and I don't have a problem with the rear locking so obviously something isn't rite . If u grab the rear brake like a panic merchant it will lock up simple lol so don't grab it hard like that .

 

[pierre]

Nice story on the motocross and yes your right if you have to think about it, its too late! I learned weight transfer backing a Ducati into a corner on the track, never locked it though as that means you just fell off.

Why oh why would I ever want to lay a bike down??? it stops quicker with the rubber bits on the road, and you can still steer it while slowing down (takes a bit more skill to turn under heavy braking) The only time I ever 'Layed it down' was when it all went tits up and I had already fell off!
Dude I crashed at 120mph at Silverstone UK (my fault the wet white bit at the edge has no grip) you slide a bl**dy long way if you 'Lay it down' and it hurts, far better to keep it black side down at ALL TIMES!

Will go away now and read your post 'A bad day riding'

Happy new year
Pierre

 

[joey fletcher]

Pierre

When I was young and been riding about 6 or 7 yrs.....I made a mistake...

I "ASSUMED".......I was riding down a 2 lane country road...55 mph speed limit. I was coming up on an intersection to my right. It was just a T intersection coming on to the road I was on. I watched the lady stop...she looked at me...I looked into her eyes...She looked to the right then back to me again..At that point in time I was sure she had saw me and was waiting for me to go by...I eased back into the throttle...an....OMG...I saw the front finder raise up over the front tire....she pulled out dead infront of me..
I locked the rear brake ...jacked the handle bars to the right.....sucked up my left leg...the bike made contact with the pavement 5 feet before impact with the car.
My front wheel hit her front wheel and the rear of the bike jammed under the car so hard a wrecker had to life the car to get the bike out.
It knocked the wind out of me...skint my left leg and left forearm just a little...But it did break the chin bar on my Bell helment

Please....Do Not Assume..

 

[pierre]

Pierre

When I was young and been riding about 6 or 7 yrs.....I made a mistake...

I "ASSUMED".......I was riding down a 2 lane country road...55 mph speed limit. I was coming up on an intersection to my right. It was just a T intersection coming on to the road I was on. I watched the lady stop...she looked at me...I looked into her eyes...She looked to the right then back to me again..At that point in time I was sure she had saw me and was waiting for me to go by...I eased back into the throttle...an....OMG...I saw the front finder raise up over the front tire....she pulled out dead infront of me..
I locked the rear brake ...jacked the handle bars to the right.....sucked up my left leg...the bike made contact with the pavement 5 feet before impact with the car.
My front wheel hit her front wheel and the rear of the bike jammed under the car so hard a wrecker had to life the car to get the bike out.
It knocked the wind out of me...skint my left leg and left forearm just a little...But it did break the chin bar on my Bell helment

Please....Do Not Assume..

Five feet of correct braking lost, you could have walked away! no assumptions made pal.

I'm also a member of the Institute of Advanced Motorcycling IAM look them up and please don't tell anyone to lay a bike down it does not work.

Sorry but a pet hate of mine, it looks silly on the old Tv shows and that is where it should stay.

I know the old saying on opinions so don't quote it. Sorry to have rattled your cage as they say.

Have a good day friend

Pierre

 

[joey fletcher]

No problem...Pierre

"Five feet of correct braking lost, you could have walked away! no assumptions made pal."

No offence taken...But in 1971...with drum brakes and 50 to 55 mph and a 20 some foot buick dead infront of you....I don't think so....I was there you were not...
At 55 mph and that bike I might have been able to miss her if I had 100 to 150 feet to react. Not 25 to 30 feet. The bike was a 1971 H1 Kaw. 500 tripple just 5 months old

I did walk away...sore to be sure..The bike did not...it was hauled away..

The Tac and speedo was busted...from my helment..I guess..The fuel tank was pushed in about 2 1/2 inches from the top side...My body. The right handle bar was bent down from hanging on until impact.

I have often wondered what would have happened if I hit that car sitting up on the bike just braking...How much speed could I have scrubbed off before impact. How hard my lower body would have hit the front of the motorcycle then into the side of the car....What would have my upper body hit and how hard????...Oh...don't forget about the head.

I think I made the right choice for me at that moment in time...

Let me clear up one thing....ASSUME....I assumed that she saw me....I was wrong... I made the mistake ...not her...It was 100% my fault...and I did learn from that mistake I made..
Plus if I get killed tomorrow...by a car pulling or turning in front of me....IT WAS MY FAULT.

NEVER ASSUME that Car is NOT going to pull out in front of you.....it will

NEVER ASSUME the car will NOT turn in front of you.....it will

PLAN...on them to pull out in front of you
PLAN.. on them to turn in front of you
NEVER STOP behind any vehicle....ALWAYS to the right or left...You might can stand being knocked up the road 30 or 40 feet....But not the meat in a steel sandwich

Ride Safe my Friend

 

[scot in exile]

As an MSF instructor I am for ever telling my students that at intersections unless the driver is calling out your name and standing beside the vehicle naked they do not see you, never never ever assume just because they are looking at you that they see you.