20226 - I don't get it

[Leif Almberg]

Triumph Tune, how the secondaries are open, I dont get it

I extracted a friends map today.
He has a std Rocket-07 with Triumph stock 20226 map.

It is identical to he one on Tom's site of course.
OEM_Tune_list
http://www.tomhamburg.net/Tunes_in_...ed_by_model/all_Rocket/RocketIII/20226Map.hex

the secondaries are identical on all gears. and how they open, it looks really weirds.
the serie for the secs opened in percent is
100-100-92-70-49-38-36-39-43-49-60-91-100-100

on all gears, identical.

this means, that apart for the ignition retardation changes, a GIPro can only improve a little, not like it is meant to do.
i checked the 20228, same thing there.

I thought that a GIPro w/ ATRE should mimic a gear where the secs are opened all the time. how many of the GIPro users out there have this config? if there are no gear with secs 100% open all rpms, then what's the use with the GIpro?

with the secs more than half closed on lots of rpms, there are certainly room for improvement.

 

[HellFire]

The best use of a GiPro is to yank out the secondaries, the main purpose is to restore the timing retard in 1st-3rd gears, hence the "w/ATRE" function.

 

[xhdskip]

That, and the nifty gear indicator.

 

[HellFire]

Oh yeah ... that too.

 

[Leif Almberg]

Yeah! I understand that "GIPro W/ ATRE" means
Gear Indicator Pro(?) with Advanced timing retardation elimination or such.

my sole question is the huge performance gain that people experience by adding a GIPro.

first of all, they have more to gain by remapping or removing the secondaries.

second, is it really that much performance gain, the secs still in place, or is some of the gain only in the mind of the driver...?


I know several people that think that their secs are fully open on all rpms, thanks to their GIPro...my only goal is to help them to understand that more can be done.

 

[Pig9r]

You found the problem with loading the triumph off-road exhaust tune. People think that the tune should give you more power. How triumph increases fueling is by decreasing air flow. The result is less power. If you had the standard triumph tune loaded then the GI Pro would keep the secondaries open 100% because the ECU thinks it is in 4th gear.

So it works like this, if you have one of the offroad tunes loaded, GI Pro will only remove the timing restrictions in 1st through 3rd gears. If the standard tune is loaded then you get the timing restrictions removed in 1st through 3rd gears and you get the secondaries open 100% in 1st through 3rd gears, which is about 6% more power.

You have TuneECU so I wouldn't mess with GI Pro unless you want a gear indicator.

Here are the secondaries for the standard tune:



And for the offroad pipes tune:




The difference in the numbers you posted are likely the difference between how Tuneboy and TuneEcu convert the voltages to % values.

 

[scot in exile]

And if you can count up to five then you do not need the pro thingymajig.

 

[Leif Almberg]

And if you can count up to five then you do not need the pro thingymajig.

good written Pig9r. I almost got bashed on the other site. people didn't want to believe this, it seemed. oh well. their loss.
so many claim that they see their secs open fully thanks to GIPro. of course! but they have a map that is written for secs open. Triumph stock is not written that way!

yeah Scot. sometimes the GIPro is probably just a very expensive resistor and machine that can count to 5

as for myself, I have a roadster. built in gear indicator and tuned with Tuneboy. I'm good!

 

[barbagris]

the serie for the secs opened in percent is
100-100-92-70-49-38-36-39-43-49-60-91-100-100 on all gears, identical.

Mmm - looks like a midrange stifler - Would explain why I'm currently running the GI as just an indicator. I can count to five even without seeing my toes - but more importantly I can't remember - **** CRS. Found it smoother in low gears without forcing fourth in.

tbh I'd only looked at one map to date and it was not 226. The one I'd seen has open secondaries in 4th and 5th.

But! - I now have my FTDI cable (plus filters and such) and can start playing - sorry tuning

I'll be "looking" at mine tomorrow - I hope.

Leif - have you fitted the blower yet?

 

[Leif Almberg]

Mmm - looks like a midrange stifler - Would explain why I'm currently running the GI as just an indicator. I can count to five even without seeing my toes - but more importantly I can't remember - **** CRS. Found it smoother in low gears without forcing fourth in.

tbh I'd only looked at one map to date and it was not 226. The one I'd seen has open secondaries in 4th and 5th.

But! - I now have my FTDI cable (plus filters and such) and can start playing - sorry tuning

I'll be "looking" at mine tomorrow - I hope.

Leif - have you fitted the blower yet?

good to hear you got cable and stuff, keep up! half motorcycling, half computering in the garage...

no, not yet. the blower will come on after winter. TTS hasn't send it yet, they lack some new parts and the garage where I and my friend will install it is still being built.

I do have a really good garage and workshop of my own but I have decided to do this install with my friend who is a senior mechanics, although without garage until januari...