Lower Timing Chain Blew-up!!!!!!!

[Gunshots]

Flip:

Where's your zest for adventure

the e-way is dull and boring anyway

 

[busajack]

Flip:

Where's your zest for adventure

the e-way is dull and boring anyway

Gunshots, I don't mind sliding down the hiway on my ass at 75 MPH, I've done It before..But when It costs me money I get pissed..TeHe Crazy Jack

 

[av8r4fun]

Betcha that bike made some interesting noises before it quit running from an acute lack of compression......

Interestingly or not, it just got more quiet. As mentioned, I have Jars on board and the engine really didn't sound loud, just different. Kinda like blaaahhh, when you hit the gas. It also had no power from 2000 rpm to about 5500 rpm. Once it got to about 6000 rpm, it picked up power again?? Go figure. I have been around enough motors to realize I might have lost a cylinder. I was thinking maybe burned valves due to a lean fuel condition?? Don't ask why, just a hunch. Boy was that hunch off. As mentioned earlier, pulled up to a stop sign and she went CLIK and died. No re-start fire, just turnover and bang. Almost like chitty chitty bang bang. It did get the attention from those in the Handi-mart parking lot.

Ride Safe!!!!

 

[Triple Trouble]

I will keep everyone updated as this progresses along. The dealer will keep all parts replaced, as I have requested. And I can analyze once I see them. I know valves, head, cam, chain, sprokets,etc will be replaced. I did ask if any damage was done to the piston or walls, he said no! Surprising, since typically when a valve sticks they would or could hit the piston?? !!!!

I think this is what you missed?

 

[Sidecar Flip]

I will keep everyone updated as this progresses along. The dealer will keep all parts replaced, as I have requested. And I can analyze once I see them. I know valves, head, cam, chain, sprockets,etc will be replaced. I did ask if any damage was done to the piston or walls, he said no! Surprising, since typically when a valve sticks they would or could hit the piston?? My mechanical buddy mentioned that to me. I have never had this engine apart to know, just odd more damage wasn't done to the engine. Must be a pretty tough design. He did mention that the valve stems are made very small to get the horsepower up where it currently is, paraphrasing. Hence, it doesn't take much to bend and fail them.

I guess I did. There is a lot of information coming down all at once. Lets add this to the fray....'the valve stems are made very small to get the horsepower up where it currently is'.......

With 8.7 to 1 compression and really mild cam profiles the R3 engine is no horsepower bomb to begin with. It's a torque engine, not a horsepower engine and while it might not take much to bend and fail the valves, only a defect in the valve timing could bend them and they only bent when they contacted the piston crown and that's the only way. Av8r4fun stated he wasn't running the bike at the rev limiter or over it on a downshift that would cause the valves to float and other than a broken timing chain, the only other cause of valves hitting the piston is valve float induced by over revving the motor. I've seen a number of diesel engines with dropped valves and the pistons always and I mean always bear the marks of the valve. They either have a bad case of acne or they actually come apart. The pistons in the R3 bear a remarkable resemblance to the pistons in a Caterpillar except the pistons in the Rocket are one piece and the Cat pistons are 2 piece, that is, the skirts are separate and pinned to the crowns. By dropped valve I mean the keeper broke allowing the valve to drop into the combustion chamber and making an interference fit. It only happens on one cylinder not two.

No matter, it seems to be an escalating problem. It's gonna get interesting I'm sure.

 

[Sidecar Flip]

Interestingly or not, it just got more quiet. As mentioned, I have Jars on board and the engine really didn't sound loud, just different. Kinda like blaaahhh, when you hit the gas. It also had no power from 2000 rpm to about 5500 rpm. Once it got to about 6000 rpm, it picked up power again?? Go figure. I have been around enough motors to realize I might have lost a cylinder. I was thinking maybe burned valves due to a lean fuel condition?? Don't ask why, just a hunch. Boy was that hunch off. As mentioned earlier, pulled up to a stop sign and she went CLIK and died. No re-start fire, just turnover and bang. Almost like chitty chitty bang bang. It did get the attention from those in the Handi-mart parking lot.

Ride Safe!!!!

I imagine that it's a pretty big order for one cylinder to drag two dead ones through the motions..........if it could, I'd imagine the gas mileage would really suck.

I'd wish you good luck but what I really want to say is I wish all of us 'others' that we don't have to go through your ordeal and hopefully we get some closure from Triumph but after the spoke and final drive things, I'm doubting it. It's like Triumph fixes the final drive defects but never admits any responsibility. The spoke thing, well, I've gotten away from the debate on the Bonneville forum (Delphi). It got almost as bad as the Hombre and the Aussie thing on .com

 

[britman]

My two Cents

OK, I feel somewhat like the kid who farted at the birthday party with this "Paint Can Rattle" issue. av8r4fun, I guess you must be the one who dropped a whole load just as the candles were being blown out with your bottom sprocket going and causing the damage to the valve train. Since my rattle has been eliminated via warranty, please feel free to come back at me full force and please know I am in no way defending Triumph in this matter. I too feel a full recall is in order for all 2005 and early 2006 R/3's. Bring them in and replace the cam chain and components on just good will. Will this happen, I doubt it very seriously, but I will be filling out the form tonight with the consumer site listed hopefully to aid in this dispute. I think we also need to consider other factors as far the rattle goes. I don't think all bikes in the above time frame have the problem. Secondly, I think the degree of noise and defect wear may vary. One member on this site has had the noise off and on and has over 40 k on his machine. Mine was rattling like hell when I pulled out for Nashville on RAA2 and I pushed it to the limit for the whole 1700 miles with no problems what so ever other than the noise. I believe Rocky and Wilbur from this site are in the process of the having their machines done via Triumph warranty, so they will make the repairs if you push it. Should all effected bikes be checked, absolutely. Will this happen, probably not. Will I buy another Rocket, you bet. I still love this motorcycle and I think we have to realize, it is a cult bike and experimental in nature with the first years of production. I know this, I rode mine to a Harley rider bike night this week, it still drew more crowds than any HD in the lot. Here is my advice from a former "rattler". If you have warranty left, take them in and have them checked for the problem. You will at least be on file if the problem occurs later. If out of warranty, ride them like you stole them and explore every avenue to push for a full recall.

 

[busajack]

Britman

Hay dude I hope your output shaft bearing blows up..Ha just kidden..You do know that 07s have been affected by these problems..Bet If someone gets killed Triumph will listen and I hope they take the wrongful death award out of bloors ass because It all comes down to him..A recall might cut into his beer money...BJC

 

[Sidecar Flip]

Wrongful life...

Jack:

I'd prefer a PI suit over wrongful death. You are legally bound in wrongful death to only sue one time and only collect one time.

With a PI suit, you can sue for a number of things including pain and suffering, loss of wages, discontinuation of services, impotence and mental anguish and then your heirs can turn around and sue again. PI is the way to go. You know, slide on your butt for a couple hundred feet and have the bike overtake you and grind you in the pavement. you live but you are rich, your spouse is rich, the kids are rich, your dog is rich.........

Money is the lubrication of everything. Bloor has plenty, time to share.

 

[britman]

2 more cents

Hay dude I hope your output shaft bearing blows up..Ha just kidden..You do know that 07s have been affected by these problems..Bet If someone gets killed Triumph will listen and I hope they take the wrongful death award out of bloors ass because It all comes down to him..A recall might cut into his beer money...BJC

Jack:

I'd prefer a PI suit over wrongful death. You are legally bound in wrongful death to only sue one time and only collect one time.

With a PI suit, you can sue for a number of things including pain and suffering, loss of wages, discontinuation of services, impotence and mental anguish and then your heirs can turn around and sue again. PI is the way to go. You know, slide on your butt for a couple hundred feet and have the bike overtake you and grind you in the pavement. you live but you are rich, your spouse is rich, the kids are rich, your dog is rich.........

Money is the lubrication of everything. Bloor has plenty, time to share.

Gentlemen,

I think the whole basic problem is QUALITY CONTROL. I contend that Triumph is no worst or better than most other companies out there producing modes of transportation. My wife has a 2002 Nissan Altima that was the subject of a recall several months ago to replace the entire rear axle assembly due to rust corrosion problems. This was probably brought about from several car ass ends laying on Interstates in the Northern States (IE Michigan) from the heavy amounts of road salts deteriorating poor quality steel in the initial manufacturing. I talked to a Harley rider at bike night last week. His new Road King has been in the shop three times since purchased two months ago for fuel injection problems. I believe the new BMW cruisers have had some rear shaft seal failures also. From so much out sourcing for most of the brands out there, no one gives a crap about the product they produce anymore. Pride in workmanship is a tradition that has almost entirely disappeared in our lifetimes. Does this make the "rattle" in your Rocket any less or reduce the worry factor that entire cam chain is going come through the front of the motor, hell no. For those guys out of the warranty period it does lead to one place with quality and pride in workmanship still exists, your own garage. There are guys on this site who have great talent in spinning wrenches. The parts to do the fix are around $500.00 and I think it will be just a matter of time before someone does just that. It is a cam chain and sprockets and as Sightglass stated considerably more complicated than doing a small block Chevy, but I bet it can be done by a good mechanic even if he isn't wearing a Triumph logo on his shirt. I still think the Rocket is most enjoyable motorcycle I have ever owned, and in the words of the infamous Forrest Gump, "That's all I've got to say about that."