Can You See Me Now - Aux Lights for the 3R

1olbull said:

These lights do look nice, BUT . . .
In my world of crash reconstruction and motorcycle lighting optics, any production LED side light costing under $100 US is inadequate.
Get a light meter reading at 1 meter for lux and I would bet that object identifiable light cast forward would be less than 200 feet and perhaps even less. Remember that at 60 mph you move 88 feet every second and at night you will have about a 2 second response time for a simple response.
By the time you react and apply brakes, or swerve, that 200 or less feet is gone. You have struck the hazard at or near 60 mph.
Just trying to be helpful - absolutely NO offense intended.

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No offense taken. I've been following you @1olbull for years here and respect your opinion. I'm a professional photographer, so could actually take a light meter reading if I wanted to, but I can tell you that these are super bright. Waaaaay more than the headlights. I have them pointed down. If you stand 15 feet from them you'll be left with an after image. You can't stare at them. Not so, from the headlights.

So, yes, the farther away you are the less intense they will be, but true for your headlights, as well. It's not really the projected light I'm after in this case, it's the intensity you experience looking at them. Because they are small and concentrated they are a stronger light source when looking at them. They're like projector (condenser) lenses. No way I could run them at night! The glare would absolutely blind drivers.

A pipe putting out x amount of water/second may have a wide spread and high volume, but a lesser amount of water from a smaller pipe is going to shoot out further and if you stand in front of it and you're more likely to get wet from further away.

Feel free to challenge me on this. I could get back 100 yards and shoot a picture to show you that a driver is going to see these lights more strongly then the headlights.

For visibility in front of me I might choose another light, but Clearwaters and such are really not necessary if you just want marker lights vs. added light for you to see in front of the bike. I want daylight protection. As much as I ride, I try to avoid riding at night as much as I can- deer.

I had a set of these on a couple of BMWs and my R3T. The flashing option is illegal in some states, but I ran them flashing full time and never had a problem.

HyperWhites Flashing | Hyperlites, flashing LED motorcycle brake lights

GPMAZ said:

I had a set of these on a couple of BMWs and my R3T. The flashing option is illegal in some states, but I ran them flashing full time and never had a problem.

HyperWhites Flashing | Hyperlites, flashing LED motorcycle brake lights

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I got some of those off eBay for dirt cheap a good while back, but have not mounted them.

Journeyman28778 said:

I got some of those off eBay for dirt cheap a good while back, but have not mounted them.

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Only anecdotal of course, but in the many miles I put on with those set to flashing I don't recall ever having anyone pull out in front of me. There were a couple of times when following other riders that they've asked me to turn them off. Very distracting in the mirrors I was told. I also did very little after dark riding and when I did I turned the flashing off. They provide little to no illumination of the road.

GPMAZ said:

Only anecdotal of course, but in the many miles I put on with those set to flashing I don't recall ever having anyone pull out in front of me. There were a couple of times when following other riders that they've asked me to turn them off. Very distracting in the mirrors I was told. I also did very little after dark riding and when I did I turned the flashing off. They provide little to no illumination of the road.

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They provide little to no illumination of the road.

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You're kind of reinforcing my point about the lights I just installed. They,re not for illuminating the road (and I may not have made that clear in my original post), but they can be obnoxiously good at getting attention. In the case of cars, that's a good thing.

Journeyman28778 said:

You're kind of reinforcing my point about the lights I just installed. They,re not for illuminating the road (and I may not have made that clear in my original post), but they can be obnoxiously good at getting attention. In the case of cars, that's a good thing.

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No kind of about it. Lights capable of significantly augmenting stock lighting in illuminating the road will be too bright to use during the daytime. Anything you can do to make yourself more visible during the day is a good thing. Does Aerostitch still make those neon riding suits. Those things, especially when new, were almost painful to look at.

Journeyman28778 said:

No offense taken. I've been following you . . .

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No challenge from me. You have well explained your purpose and your point of being seen versus seeing is a good one.
Most lights can be seen from great distance, especially at night. The problem is lights are everywhere.

Tests have shown that if a driver cannot identify what light(s) are connected to and that they present a potential hazard, the driver will NOT respond. Adding lights to create a recognizable pattern that may be moving toward you is a good thing.

Lights that allow you to see well enough to detect, identify, decide, and respond in the time & distance necessary to avoid a hazard is critical.
I hope you are not still running the OEM headlights. They can be seen during daylight, BUT at night they are inept and useless at any speed above 30 mph.
Great subject and gratitude for the compliment.
Be well-Stay well!

GPMAZ said:

I had a set of these on a couple of BMWs and my R3T. The flashing option is illegal in some states, but I ran them flashing full time and never had a problem.

HyperWhites Flashing | Hyperlites, flashing LED motorcycle brake lights

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I have used Hyperlites for years on the rear of Kong. They are a very good product. I have not visited their site in years and was unaware of these "white" lights. Very interesting and I may just spring for a set in order to test.
Gratitude for the tip!

1olbull said:

No challenge from me. You have well explained your purpose and your point of being seen versus seeing is a good one.
Most lights can be seen from great distance, especially at night. The problem is lights are everywhere.

Tests have shown that if a driver cannot identify what light(s) are connected to and that they present a potential hazard, the driver will NOT respond. Adding lights to create a recognizable pattern that may be moving toward you is a good thing.

Lights that allow you to see well enough to detect, identify, decide, and respond in the time & distance necessary to avoid a hazard is critical.
I hope you are not still running the OEM headlights. They can be seen during daylight, BUT at night they are inept and useless at any speed above 30 mph.
Great subject and gratitude for the compliment.
Be well-Stay well!

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I'm not sure I made it clear in my original post that my purpose was to be seen, rather than to see better ahead- if not, I should have.

I have the stock headlights on the 2020 3R, and they are OK, but on the Roadster I did upgrade either to what you mentioned, or very similar high end replacement. I could not see di¢k with the stock lights at night. As you said, that should be a mandatory upgrade.

1olbull said:

These lights do look nice, BUT . . .
In my world of crash reconstruction and motorcycle lighting optics, any production LED side light costing under $100 US is inadequate.
Get a light meter reading at 1 meter for lux and I would bet that object identifiable light cast forward would be less than 200 feet and perhaps even less. Remember that at 60 mph you move 88 feet every second and at night you will have about a 2 second response time for a simple response.
By the time you react and apply brakes, or swerve, that 200 or less feet is gone. You have struck the hazard at or near 60 mph.
Just trying to be helpful - absolutely NO offense intended. Up front, I run the Clearwater Erica with my JW Speaker Adaptive 2 headlights

Clearwater Lights LED Motorcycle Lights and Off-road Vehicle

At Clearwater Lights, your safety is our primary concern. Clearwater Lights are the only fully-adjustable high-powered LED auxiliary motorcycle and off-road lights available, allowing you to maximize your ability to see and be seen in constantly changing ambient light conditions.

www.clearwaterlights.com

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Bull, Where did you mount Erica? I have Darla mounted on the forks and JW Adaptive, but as usual I want more.